Curse

Age · Feb 18, 2006, 12:20 AM // 00:20

Yeah it would be nice if you wanted to redo your char. /signed

Soul Shaker · Feb 18, 2006, 12:34 AM // 00:34

How about, lvl 20 MUST HAVE ASCENDED, and only available on a 2nd prof change? That will stop the early ascenders going through.

Undivine · Feb 18, 2006, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathqueen

I still stand on what I said as many of you that gets run thru the content anyway, you deserve to have to earn something ascended or not makes no difference. Time you paid for your cheating the content. (smile)

/unsigned

Most people get run through because of tedium. I got run through on my 4th character because... well, it was my forth freaken character. I just wanted to have a necro for the high level content that my guild engages in.

If you think running is cheating then that is an entirely separate issue. Perhaps you should argue that ANet should take steps to prevent running, but to say that everyone, those who legitimately get far or those who run, should not reap the rewards does not solve the "problem" of running.

Mind you, I absolutely hate people who have not even been through the game the first time and get run. Stupid people who don't know how to play, now those people don't deserve to get far.

But this suggestion doesn't reward them, does it? They haven't unlocked anything, so they won't see the benefits of changing their secondary.

I absolutely /sign this.

Harmony · Feb 18, 2006, 12:54 AM // 00:54

Gotta agree with deathqueen on this one.

/unsigned

MinaDrakul · Feb 18, 2006, 12:55 AM // 00:55

I am also with Deathqueen on this issue.

/unsigned

actionjack · Feb 18, 2006, 01:16 AM // 01:16

I would say make it where you could Buy your account earn unlock skills from a special NPC. So you still need to sepnd the skill point and the gold, but it would allow for faster customization. The NPC could be located at maybe LA (but at higher cost) or Dragon's cave. Also show not allow Elites to be earn in such way.

Undivine · Feb 18, 2006, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by actionjack

I would say make it where you could Buy your account earn unlock skills from a special NPC. So you still need to sepnd the skill point and the gold, but it would allow for faster customization. The NPC could be located at maybe LA (but at higher cost) or Dragon's cave. Also show not allow Elites to be earn in such way.

Well, I don't mind if you make it a little more difficult than what the OP suggested, but what you are suggesting here is no different from the skill trainer at Perdition Rock. That doesn't change anything except that one gets it a little sooner, though not really since they will need to farm even more gold to aquire it. What's the point of that?

And to you others who agree with Deathqueen, can you give reasons?

Tuoba Hturt Eht · Feb 18, 2006, 02:15 AM // 02:15

In this world, you can't please everyone.
However, I'm in favour of any suggestions that lessens the grinding aspect of Guild Wars.

/signed for lesser grinding in Guild Wars

Rieselle · Feb 18, 2006, 11:05 AM // 11:05

There's another good reason different from grind - replayability.
It's often fun to play through an rpg again using a different character, since you get to play in a different style etc. However, replayability in GW is limited by the classes you choose, when it really shouldnt be. What if I wanted to play through as an Elementalist again, but with Earth skills instead of fire? That's not possible at the moment.

I guess the solutions I favour would be things like, allowing skills unlocked on your account to be purchased at any skill trainer for any of your characters. Or something like a "replay mode" where skills available at trainers are randomised or something.

Urias Skult · Feb 18, 2006, 11:27 AM // 11:27

What about if you could unlock any skill at the skill trainers, even ones that dont pertain to your current character primary or secondary class? Obviously you wouldnt be able to use IWAY for example if you are a Mo/Me or non warrior class. These skills could be bought using skill points from your present character, and kept in a form of 'storage' until you create a character who can use the skills.

That way if you want to blow all your skill points on your Level 20 Necromancer to start with a bank of skills for a Monk, you could. You would have to weigh up your options as to whether you want your current character to have all the usable skills they can or whether you make it easier for your next character.

It could work, but I do agree with others that have said you should earn skills etc. I played the game through with a Necromancer and have recently re-started as a Wammo. You get run to droks, get some decent armour but suddenly you realise that it is now meaninless as it only took you 1 hour to obtain.

SaintGreg · Feb 18, 2006, 08:49 PM // 20:49

I agree with actionjack except maybe make it so that you still have to spend the 1k gold, but not the skill point. If you want to be able to use many different skills, really the only way to do it is to farm with that specific character, which is not always possible or efficient. I have about 50 skill points on my monk, but less than 5 on my other two characters. It will still cost 1k, which is a fair amount, but you will be able to unlock alot more skills to make your character useful in more combinations without having to farm for ages on that char. In this way you couldn't buy elites with it either, so you still need to get those the hard way of actually capping them and spending the skill point on the sig-cap.

Shoujo · Feb 18, 2006, 10:17 PM // 22:17

/signed

Less grind is good.

Empathic · Feb 18, 2006, 10:28 PM // 22:28

/signed

I don't see the problem. If someone unlocks the skills in PvE on any character, then they worked for those skills. How Deathqueen can say you didn't is beyond me. If you got ran or not, you still worked for the skills, just on a different character.

Grimm · Feb 18, 2006, 10:34 PM // 22:34

/unsigned

I see no reason for this at all. It would probably only facilitate running, solo farming, etc.

Desbreko · Feb 19, 2006, 09:19 AM // 09:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathqueen

/unsigned

It's bad enough many of you run through the content already (nice rush to droks) you don't deserve the easy unlocked skills as well.

So . . . you're basing your argument here on your opinion that getting run places is wrong? Even when ArenaNet only seems to care about it when it's abused in low-level arenas? Not a great foundation if you ask me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathqueen

Bout time you earned something with EACH different character you played.

People still would be. They'd be earning their primary profession's skills just the same as now, as well as skills for their original secondary. They just wouldn't have to spend the time and money to buy skills multiple times in the event that they change their secondary.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathqueen

I still stand on what I said as many of you that gets run thru the content anyway, you deserve to have to earn something ascended or not makes no difference.

I played through the game the normal way three times before I ever got run anywhere. My fourth and fifth characters, yes, I got runs down to Droknar's. But you know what? After getting armor (the one-time investment is cheaper than getting multiple lower level sets) and the skills I wanted for the build I had planned, I went back and completed the rest of the game. I, at least, got runs primarily so that I could play the builds I wanted to play (those being an IW mesmer and a trap ranger) without having to wait till the desert or later to get the skills I needed for them.

Sure, some people get run on their first character. But as others said, this change wouldn't benefit them because they wouldn't have unlocked any skills yet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathqueen

Time you paid for your cheating the content.

I direct your attention to the fact that ArenaNet does not view getting runs as cheating, so this opinion has zero weight behind it when used as an argument for affecting the game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deathqueen

(smile)

^_^

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

Personally, I'd love to see this implemented, but I doubt it will be. If I'm not mistaken, ArenaNet upped the cost of buying skills as a gold sink, and giving people access to previously unlocked skills when they change secondaries would pretty much negate that entirely.

M3lk0r · Feb 19, 2006, 08:07 PM // 20:07

Deathqueen, I've played through the game with FOUR chars WITHOUT A SINGLE RUN ANYWHERE. I have done EVERY skill-awarding quest and more on all of them. I have waited for 2+ hours sometimes just to get a group with my ranger but still endured it. I have also done THK when I was the only monk (and that was LF MONKY PuG and not a guild). I know the good, the bad and the paladins in the game.

So dont give me this bullshit of "cheating through the game"

Now if I want to try SERIOUS PvP, guess what? I need to fill specific rolls that require specific skill-sets. Oh well I though, with maxed out PvE chars (and I mean collector 15>50 weps and Drok armor) this is going easy. But no! my kindle+interrupting is petty useless to the blackout ranger I wanted to use for GvG. I needed a good couple of plats to even test out a build that I'm not sure I'll like, or be good at for that matter (even though I had learend the skills twice with my E/Me and Mo/Me). Same for my Monk, no OoB for him, even though my warr already had it (and its pretty useless on him, for that matter).

So I had to finally delete my Ele (who btw, played after the AOE update, and thus used a REAL build) and wasted ALL the 200 odd hours I had spent on maxing him out, for a PvP slot.

/end rant

RotteN · Feb 19, 2006, 08:20 PM // 20:20

realy nice idea, and the arguements presented against it are pretty weak tbh

/signed

Makkert · Feb 20, 2006, 11:20 AM // 11:20

/signed.
the way it should be imho.

Poison Ivy · Feb 20, 2006, 11:35 AM // 11:35

If they make unlocking the skills you've already obtained harder then just hiring a runner, then I'll put my sig on it, otherwise...

/unsigned

Renegade ++RIP++ · Feb 20, 2006, 11:58 AM // 11:58

I just wished that there where some more quests specific for skills that you could do like you had at the start, in stead of that farming for skillpoints and gold...

So that all skills could be quested for in stead of having to farm for. Besides, the elites you already have to hunt for so that is ok.